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24HourForums.com > The Top 10 Supported Forums > 24's Religion & Philosophy > The Official Evolution vs Creation thread for 24 and PMH. |
| Moderated by: 24HourNut | Page:   1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 ...   |
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Free.man Original500© Member
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Dear friend, Fox: [You're use of FRIEND, is beginning to wear thin. It's intent or meaning falls short as of late. Sorry, but this is just my opinion in what I've been observing lately.........] Thank you for your input. I appreciate it. It's nice to hear from you. Free.man
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muddawber Guardian1000© Member 
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24HourNut wrote: Leave mud alone, he didn't evolve like the rest of us. He just WAS.  Free.man wrote: Dear friend, Where was your sense of humor when you saw the picture? I believe you when you said you found it very distasteful. I 'm not suggesting you should even find the picture humorous. I would never post such a picture of any Founder of any religion, nor would any Muslim, that I know, post such a picture. Again, I am not your friend, nor are you mind. You also fail to get my point. I was making a joke about the way the Muslims want to behead those who post pictures of Muhammed. Though I find the picture here distasteful, those who want to post such pictures have that right. Besides, it is not I who will have to pay. As for hate mongering, I hate no one. There are those I don't care for, but I can't say that I hate anyone, yet. You know nothing of my Christian identity or me, so just keep your slurs to yourself. Moreover, I don't have a need to prop up my life with hate speak, friend. A true friend would not allow another to engage in hate speak even if it may be required of some from your fellow religionists. Is this just Christianiam? It seems so. I do not prop up my life with hate speak, and again, I am not your friend.
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24HourNut Administrator  Body pillows rock!
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Hey, this thread is about evolution ...
 The best human beings start good new topics and vote on the better posts. |
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muddawber Guardian1000© Member
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24HourNut wrote: Hey, this thread is about evolution ... Sorry, but I'm not the one who posted the sacreligious picture.
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24HourNut Administrator Body pillows rock!
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Well let's get back on topic anyway. You guys can take it to PMs or another thread. Thanks.
The best human beings start good new topics and vote on the better posts. |
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Amy Original500© Member  ...going with the flow...
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cynicalninja wrote: muddawber wrote:24HourNut wrote:  here's one explanation of what happened to all of the mythical creatures.  Noah's Ark
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muddawber Guardian1000© Member
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24HourNut wrote: Well let's get back on topic anyway. You guys can take it to PMs or another thread. Thanks. Aye, aye, sir.
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Free.man Original500© Member
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foxglovepress wrote: Free.man wrote:muddawber wrote: Dear friend, The change of approach that you see is so. This come from my 3D work of over 25 years with law enforcement doing crisis intervention and reconciliation. To affect change sometimes it is seen as necessary to radically change the dynamics of a relationship(called triangulation) by switching roles. I take on a role that forces others to change themself into say the role of 'the victim' as was previously evident by the response I recieved in return. My response then was designed to identify, if or when, either that person changes roles again or that someone else will insert themselves by claiming a role themselves. That role is called "the savior". The savior tries to save the victim. Then, the victim or the savior may try to take over the role of the aggressor. The triangulation then often continues by constant changing of roles and no one wins. The only way the cycle stops is when most who are involved refuse to play the game by learning about themselves accepting some resposibility for their own behavior. In this case I took over as the aggressor to force the issue. Who took on the other rolls and why? Just askin? Your comment about the "real Baha'i coming out" is, I believe, worth investigating here or in another thread. It goes to the question about me and or any Baha'i aniam. I've already posted a similar thread about 'Christianiams' if you so choose to post there. I do agree that Muslims are not seen in a very good light here in America and we may want to have a thread on that also. I had a long conversation with a Iranian Muslim about this very subject last Saturday. He also had some very critical things to say about the Mullahs and how they are currently destroying Iran. This man has been a US citizen for some 40+ years by now. While I am not Muslim, I will defend them from unwarented attacks just like I defend Christians, Jews, Buddists and so forth in other forums that are attacked by others were there is no one present from that religion to defend themselves. I find there are enough Christians here on 24 that can defend themselves. As for which religion is the most violent; I find there is no equalizing. However, the Baha'i Faith is pretty much void of any violence. There was violence in the Bab'i Faith before Baha'u'llah made His claim. Baha'u'llah(like Jesus) never committed violence on anyone and specifically forbid His followers to do so. I, as a Baha'i, work in crisis intervention. I've seen enough violence for ten lifetimes and had to get very assertive at times towards others because of it. I know Baha'is who are in prison. I have done interventions in Baha'i homes. I've investigated Baha'is for criminal activity. I've investigated police officers, school principles, college administraters, Lawyers, and military personel. That does not mean we should not have any police, nor schools, nor the military. I have no problem with taking responsibility for my own actions. Regardless of whether I do or not always take responsibilty for myself I will continue to call others as I see em. Free.man Note: You brought up some great subjects here. Thanx
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foxglovepress Forum-Blogger© Original500© Member  NON-PC!!
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Thank you for responding Free.man. I may just go into those threads you've suggested. Though I respect your back ground, remember Ted Bundy also worked in a crisis center...........
Justice for Mark.....Imprison Employers Who Hire ILLEGALS! |
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24HourNut Administrator Body pillows rock!
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Free.man wrote: Your comment about the "real Baha'i coming out" is, I believe, worth investigating here or in another thread. No, NOT here. I already requested that we get back on-topic to evolution. You've ignored it by posting/responding to the other material, again. So let me be clearer: end the off-topic comments or access to this forum will be removed.
The best human beings start good new topics and vote on the better posts. |
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Amy Original500© Member ...going with the flow...
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Amy wrote:
This is on topic.   (it's just a minute or two video clip from Robot Chicken, which I thought was rather clever myself.) 
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pmh1nic Pioneer100© Member 
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"I am not claiming common decent based on "similarities." That was the point. I was basing it on a wide range of overlapping lines of evidence from the world-wide scientific community." Common decent is claimed by the scientific community based on similarities among species. The scientific community points to similarities in physiology and genetic make-up. What they and you ignor is the fact that the genetic difference cannot be bridged with a microevolutionary process repeated millions of times. "That is my point - your position as to where people came from is from the Bible" That position is supported by genetic evidence. The fact that the Bible also expresses that position should not be a part of this discussion if we are going to talk about the science regarding the origin of life. You can't argue against that science by simply stating that the science agrees with what the Bible says. Making that argument is an expression of narrow minded religious bias. "I never claimed to know how life on Earth started and branched out in detail, nor have I studied the path to the first life forms." How convenient. "I already said long strings of repeated micro evolutionary activity from niche exploitation and such is what all the science supports. Lots of gradual steps from primates to semi-human hominids, then to pre-humans, then to "cavemen," then to modern humans." And as I said that bit of speculation defies what we know regarding genetics and mutations. It also defies the logic that you don't get new information from collecting garbage and happenstance. "Your position includes dinosaurs getting off the Ark, does it not?" This is an area that the Bible really doesn't say anything about. We don't know what kinds of animals existed during the time of the flood. I have no idea if dinosaurs (infant or adult) were on the ark. "Correct me if I am wrong, but your position is that all existing species, including people, can be traced back to whatever was on the Ark, right?" As far as animials are concerned all existing kinds of animals would be traced back to those that were saved in the ark from the flood. "Once again, your position on the path of life development on Earth is religious-based." There is no real conflict between science and the Bible. The conflict comes in for two reasons, making claims that the Bible provides a fact of science on an issue (the age of the Earth) when it doesn't and/or claiming something has been proven via the scientific method when it has not. The Bible is very clear that the universe had a begin. This has been confirmed by hard science. The Bible does not (contrary to the claims of some) provide a means to calculate the time that has elapsed from that beginning until now. Neither does the Bible provide a means to calculate the age of man, although it appears very clear that man is the product of special creation. The Bible gives no indication that man is the product of an evolutionary process. Some try to torture the language used to describe the special creation of man (formed from the dust of the ground) to make evolution fit. But genetic science appears to show that advanced life forms cannot be the product of an evolutionary process, whether you're talking ameba to man or ape to man. "Once again, here is the point: I go by the world-wide scientific community's findings and positions" And once again you would be stating a half-truth since the "world-wide scientific" community is not in unison on this issue.
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24HourNut Administrator Body pillows rock!
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Common decent is claimed by the scientific community based on similarities among species. The scientific community points to similarities in physiology and genetic make-up. What they and you ignor is the fact that the genetic difference cannot be bridged with a microevolutionary process repeated millions of times. Humans evolving from primates is based upon FAR FAR FAR more than just similarities. Apparently you aren't aware of that so that might be the source of your confusion. "That is my point - your position as to where people came from is from the Bible" There is no evidence that there was an Adam & Eve and that we did anything other than evolve from primates. Adam & Eve (the Bible view of where humans came from) is all speculation and personal interpretation of the Bible. Not science. That is why your positions are always at odds with science. That speaks to the inherent conflict between archaic superstitious or embellished text, and real science. Regardless, I am glad you acknowledge that your position as to where people came from is from the Bible, since it so obviously poisons and shapes your views. And as I said that bit of speculation defies what we know regarding genetics and mutations. It also defies the logic that you don't get new information from collecting garbage and happenstance. Sorry, microevolution is not speculation, we know it happens. There is nothing in science negating the mountain of evidence pointing to lots of microevolutionary steps between primate and man. Again, I will go with the world-wide scientific community, you go with the Bible. This is an area that the Bible really doesn't say anything about. We don't know what kinds of animals existed during the time of the flood. I have no idea if dinosaurs (infant or adult) were on the ark. Try using SCIENCE to determine something as ridiculous as dinosaurs being on the ark with people. You DON'T know if they were on the Ark because you are brainwashed into thinking the Bible is the answer to these questions so if the Bible doesn't tell you, you don't even rely on science. Your religious poisoning has crippled your critical thinking skills. You throw out science wholesale. The amount of science needed to be thrown out to adopt all of your views is absurd - you are like a throwback to the dark ages, using obviously outdated text or superstitious embellishments as your guide. That is why you don't know if dinosaurs were on the ark. "Correct me if I am wrong, but your position is that all existing species, including people, can be traced back to whatever was on the Ark, right?" As we can see you use the Bible as the starting point about where species, including people, have come and gone. That was my point. The Bible gives no indication that man is the product of an evolutionary process. I know - just like it gives no indication of lots of commonly understood things by modern people. The Bible NOT indicating something is a ridiculous criteria by which to judge something in science. Yet, you do it regularly. Your views are founded upon speculation and personal interpretation or religious feelings about archaic text. That is not only speculation, it isn't science at all. There is no reason to go with your speculation and religious based position regarding where humans and current species came from when science has a mountain of real evidence. Your religious feelings or Bible interpretations are not science - they are speculation. Remember that each time you do something as silly as call evolution between man and primate "speculation" when there is a mountain of real overlapping evidence from many scientific fields supporting it ... and what supports YOUR story is something as unscientific and speculative as the embellishments in the Bible. It's absurd. The authors didn't even know the Earth was a sphere in orbit, about microscopic items, about other continents, natural tsunamis, meteors, species going extinct, how millions of years can pass since a species goes extinct - none of that. That is why you are stuck in these ridiculous traps where you have to support notions like lfe on Earth may only have been around for thousands of years. You are a fine example of how religion muddies the sciences and progress, as Jefferson and so many others have expressed and worked to improve.
The best human beings start good new topics and vote on the better posts. |
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pmh1nic Pioneer100© Member
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"Humans evolving from primates is based upon FAR FAR FAR more than just similarities. Apparently you aren't aware of that so that might be the source of your confusion." If there is FAR, FAR, FAR more involved then similarities you'll have no problem sharing a few details. "There is no evidence that there was an Adam & Eve and that we did anything other than evolve from primates." Where have you been.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitochondrial_Eve "Sorry, microevolution is not speculation, we know it happens." As usual you not only mis-state what I said but misunderstand what science has and hasn't proven. I never said microevolution was speculation. What I said was extending the microevolutionary process to account for ameba to man is speculation in the extreme and not supported by genetic science. "Again, I will go with the world-wide scientific community, you go with the Bible." Not. I go with hard science versus scientific speculations. "Try using SCIENCE to determine something as ridiculous as dinosaurs being on the ark with people." Again, I never said dinosaurs were in the ark. "As we can see you use the Bible as the starting point about where species, including people, have come and gone." Wrong again. My starting point when it comes to issues of science is HARD science. Unfortunately for you if hard science happens to agree with the Bible you throw the science out the window. "Remember that each time you do something as silly as call evolution between man and primate "speculation" when there is a mountain of real overlapping evidence from many scientific fields supporting it..." Wrong again. Actually calling the portion of evolutionary theory that claims man is the product of an evolutionary process that spans the genetic gap between ameba and man speculation is an understatement. You making statements of scientific fact that are not facts, you then add statements about what the Bible says on an issue when it is silent on an issue, and then wonder why there is a conflict. Your problem is ignorance and overstatement on both counts. "You are a fine example of how religion muddies the sciences and progress, as Jefferson and so many others have expressed and worked to improve." You are a fine example of the type of brainwashing produced by a public education that hasn't moved into the 21st century AND full of anti-religious bias that blinds you to the facts of hard science and logical reasoning. Last edited on 09:16 pm by pmh1nic |
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Brian Grand Poobah of Moderation 
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pmh1nic wrote: There is no evidence that there was an Adam & Eve and that we did anything other than evolve from primates." | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
