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24HourForums.com > The Top 10 Supported Forums > 24's Religion & Philosophy > The Official Evolution vs Creation thread for 24 and PMH.

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24HourNut
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 Posted: 01:36 am

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If there is FAR, FAR, FAR more involved then similarities you'll have no problem sharing a few details.

http://www.24hourforums.com/view_topic.php?id=4558&forum_id=97

God loved evolution and primates so much, he made everything look like we evolved from them ... to trick us!  That crazy hell-torturing maniacal goofy ass madman, I love him!




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 Posted: 03:17 am

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Brian

What the science says is that this person "Eve" is the common ancestor of EVERY LIVING PERSON. She is a bottleneck as far as every living person is concerned. The point isn't speculations about whether she is the Biblical Eve but rather the common ancestry that exist among humans.
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 Posted: 03:20 am

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24hournut

You've got to be kidding me. All of the points in the article deal with commonality while ignoring the critical issue of the differences, the gap an evolutionary process that cannot bridge that gap.
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 Posted: 04:13 am

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pmh1nic wrote: 24hournut

You've got to be kidding me. All of the points in the article deal with commonality while ignoring the critical issue of the differences, the gap an evolutionary process that cannot bridge that gap.
I know what you mean about that science stuff.  Why use what these crazy scientists say when we have the Bible as our guide? 

Let me ask you a few questions about cavemen since they are in the middle of this nutty evolution talk.  Do you consider cro magnon and neanderthals to be human?  Is it your position that there were cavemen after Adam & Eve, even though people were apparently already using human language well?  I can't seem to place all those early cavemen fossils and findings comfortably into your previously stated positions.  Or do you dismiss another mother load of science and claim that there were no cavemen that had to learn how to make fire and communicate and all that?




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 Posted: 04:18 am

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24HourNut wrote: pmh1nic wrote: 24hournut

You've got to be kidding me. All of the points in the article deal with commonality while ignoring the critical issue of the differences, the gap an evolutionary process that cannot bridge that gap.
I know what you mean about that science stuff.  Why use what these crazy scientists say when we have the Bible as our guide? 

Let me ask you a few questions about cavemen since they are in the middle of this nutty evolution talk.  Do you consider cro magnon and neanderthals to be human?  Is it your position that there were cavemen after Adam & Eve, even though people were apparently already using human language well?  I can't seem to place all those early cavemen fossils and findings comfortably into your previously stated positions.  Or do you dismiss another mother load of science and claim that there were no cavemen that had to learn how to make fire and communicate and all that?


Satan planted all the bones of the cavemen, along with their tools and did all the paintings.
God helped him, so that Christians would have their faith tested by being tempted to follow the Devil's work and believe that Cro-Magnon and Neanderthal Man actually existed.

Good Christians pass the test--- bad people just PRETENDING to be Christians fail and believe the bones are real, in spite of what the Bible clearly literally says.

If you believe in those bones and things and don't see RIGHT through Satan's little tricks, you're going to hell.

Fast.




Armed with the power of Thy name nothing can ever hurt me, and with Thy love in my heart all the world's afflictions can in no wise alarm me.
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 Posted: 05:26 am

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pmh1nic wrote: Brian

What the science says is that this person "Eve" is the common ancestor of EVERY LIVING PERSON. She is a bottleneck as far as every living person is concerned. The point isn't speculations about whether she is the Biblical Eve but rather the common ancestry that exist among humans.
Hi, PMH.

The article that you linked to in Wikipedia has this passage:

Mitochondrial Eve is the most recent common matrilineal ancestor, not the most recent common ancestor (MRCA) of all humans. The MRCA's offspring have led to all living humans via sons and daughters, but Mitochondrial Eve must be traced only through female lineages, so she is estimated to have lived much longer ago than the MRCA. While Mitochondrial Eve is thought to have been living around 140,000 years ago, according to probabilistic studies,[2] the MRCA could have been living as recently as 3,000 years ago.[3]
Allan Wilson's naming Mitochondrial Eve[4] after Eve of the Genesis creation story has led to some misunderstandings among the general public. A common misconception is that Mitochondrial Eve was the only living human female of her time. It is theoretically possible that she was the only human female of her time; however, had she been the only living female of her time, humanity would most likely have become extinct due to an extreme population bottleneck.
Indeed, not only were many women alive at the same time as Mitochondrial Eve but many of them have descendants alive today. They may have left descendants via either son or daughters (and grandsons or granddaughters, and so on). Nuclear genes from these contemporary women of Mitochondrial Eve are present in today's population, but mitochondrial DNA from them is not.[1]
What distinguishes Mitochondrial Eve (and her matrilineal ancestors) from all her female contemporaries is that she has a purely matrilineal line of descent to all humans alive today, whereas all her female contemporaries with descendants alive today have at least one male in every line of descent. Because mitochondrial DNA is only passed through matrilineal descent, all humans alive today have mitochondrial DNA that is traceable back to Mitochondrial Eve. (Emphasis mine)







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 Posted: 06:00 am

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sirlamre wrote: 24HourNut wrote: pmh1nic wrote: 24hournut

You've got to be kidding me. All of the points in the article deal with commonality while ignoring the critical issue of the differences, the gap an evolutionary process that cannot bridge that gap.
I know what you mean about that science stuff.  Why use what these crazy scientists say when we have the Bible as our guide? 

Let me ask you a few questions about cavemen since they are in the middle of this nutty evolution talk.  Do you consider cro magnon and neanderthals to be human?  Is it your position that there were cavemen after Adam & Eve, even though people were apparently already using human language well?  I can't seem to place all those early cavemen fossils and findings comfortably into your previously stated positions.  Or do you dismiss another mother load of science and claim that there were no cavemen that had to learn how to make fire and communicate and all that?


Satan planted all the bones of the cavemen, along with their tools and did all the paintings.
God helped him, so that Christians would have their faith tested by being tempted to follow the Devil's work and believe that Cro-Magnon and Neanderthal Man actually existed.

Good Christians pass the test--- bad people just PRETENDING to be Christians fail and believe the bones are real, in spite of what the Bible clearly literally says.

If you believe in those bones and things and don't see RIGHT through Satan's little tricks, you're going to hell.

Fast.

Are the Bahai's as friendly to the Muslims as they are to the Christians?

Off Topic! :lmao:




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 Posted: 06:13 am

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So you won't mind if I moved it over to the MUSLIMS IN AMERICA thread, right?

Done Deal!
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 Posted: 12:15 pm

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sirlamre wrote: 24HourNut wrote: pmh1nic wrote: 24hournut

You've got to be kidding me. All of the points in the article deal with commonality while ignoring the critical issue of the differences, the gap an evolutionary process that cannot bridge that gap.
I know what you mean about that science stuff.  Why use what these crazy scientists say when we have the Bible as our guide? 

Let me ask you a few questions about cavemen since they are in the middle of this nutty evolution talk.  Do you consider cro magnon and neanderthals to be human?  Is it your position that there were cavemen after Adam & Eve, even though people were apparently already using human language well?  I can't seem to place all those early cavemen fossils and findings comfortably into your previously stated positions.  Or do you dismiss another mother load of science and claim that there were no cavemen that had to learn how to make fire and communicate and all that?


Satan planted all the bones of the cavemen, along with their tools and did all the paintings.
God helped him, so that Christians would have their faith tested by being tempted to follow the Devil's work and believe that Cro-Magnon and Neanderthal Man actually existed.

Good Christians pass the test--- bad people just PRETENDING to be Christians fail and believe the bones are real, in spite of what the Bible clearly literally says.

If you believe in those bones and things and don't see RIGHT through Satan's little tricks, you're going to hell.

Fast.

::rotfl::




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 Posted: 12:21 pm

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Edited by admin.  Please stay on topic as previously requested in this thread.

Last edited on 12:23 pm by 24HourNut
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 Posted: 02:59 pm

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Brian

Since it seems you're the only one that wants to have an intelligent discussion on this I'll respond to your post.

Let me quote from the same article:

"A common misconception is that Mitochondrial Eve was the only living human female of her time. It is theoretically possible that she was the only human female of her time; however, had she been the only living female of her time, humanity would most likely have become extinct due to an extreme population bottleneck."

My argument is that the scope of living females narrows as you go back in time. Whether she was the only human female or one of ten, twenty or fifty she is the ONE  female every living person is related to and the trend is to narrow as you go back in time.

I'd also note the use of the term most likely in the statement regarding a bottleneck indicates a lack of conclusiveness regarding the statement.

 
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 Posted: 06:01 pm

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pmh1nic wrote: Brian

Since it seems you're the only one that wants to have an intelligent discussion on this I'll respond to your post.
Yes Brian, make sure you don't ask Pmh about cro magnons or neanderthals.




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 Posted: 06:09 pm

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"Evolutionary Bottleneck" is a specific concept you know?


Population bottleneck
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Population bottlenecks)
Jump to: navigation, search

Population bottleneck and recovery or extinctionA population bottleneck (or genetic bottleneck) is an evolutionary event in which a significant percentage of a population or species is killed or otherwise prevented from reproducing, and the population is reduced by 50% or more, often by several orders of magnitude.[1]

Population bottlenecks increase genetic drift, as the rate of drift is inversely proportional to the population size. They also increase inbreeding due to the reduced pool of possible mates (see small population size).

A slightly different sort of genetic bottleneck can occur if a small group becomes reproductively separated from the main population. This is called a founder effect.
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 Posted: 06:28 pm

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24hournut

And maybe I won't ask you to post the other vast amounts of support for the evolution of ameba or ape to man that exist other then similarities in structure.

"cromagnons or neanderthals"

You can ask me about them and I'd tell you that as far as we know the remains of these creatures could be humans not much different then us or apes. Again, your claim that they are evidence of evolutionary change that bridges the gap between ameba and man (a discussion you seem to avoid at all cost) or fish to man or bird to man or amphibian to man.

You seem to think that if you start with an ape which more closely resembles a man you've solved your problem. NOT!

While the similarities between the genetics of ape and man is about 95% bridging the 5% difference amounts to millions of differences in the DNA between them. Those differences based on what we know regarding genetics cannot be bridged via genetic coding errors and natural selection which is not selection in the sense that we normally use the word but a matter of random happenstance.

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 Posted: 06:41 pm

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pmh1nic wrote: Brian

Since it seems you're the only one that wants to have an intelligent discussion on this I'll respond to your post.

I'd also note the use of the term most likely in the statement regarding a bottleneck indicates a lack of conclusiveness regarding the statement.

 


pmh1nic,

I also want to offer a comment for intelligent discussion please...


"For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse..."

Romans 1:20

:)

 




Jesus said, "Take heed that no one deceives you."

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